Music without social media?


i whether it’s a conscious, willful denial or just naive ignorance at work, I think a lot of (especially young) folks are, in a very real way, experiencing the discomforts of class disparity firsthand as they’re making an attempt to break into the biz.

what’s a shame is that seemingly no one has the capacity to address it in a helpful way. I feel terribile that a lot of talented kids get bit by the music bug at a young age and then later feel this extreme pressure to haul their asses to London/Berlin/NY/LA only to have vastly miscalculated the economics of the underground music lifestyle.

I’ve been hesitant to use terms like “trustfunders” because 1) I don’t want to come off as bitter (which I am) but mostly 2) I’m honestly just happy that there are people out there using their wealth to create art/communities instead of buying Porsches.

it just kills me that a long ass thread like this skirts around honest discussions of class for so long like it’s not a real thing driving whether or not someone makes it.


Not adding much to the discussion here but as someone who’s playing a lot of shows and meeting a lot of current big/semi-big electronic music people, I can 10000% attest to that. It’s gotten to a point where I’m starting to wonder if accidentally just stumbled into a secret society for 18-35 year old heirs (don’t seem to be bounded by ethnicity or nationality either).

And of course lots of these people are wonderful and super nice, but it’s very strange how much this music scene has discussed inequality the last few years without ever touching on class. It has probably not gone a month since the last time fader, factmag, RA or pitchfork etc has published an article discussing gender, race or queer injustice, yet the only time I think I’ve ever read an actual article about class was this self-published one by Mat Dryhurst


Firstly, great tip off on the Dryhurst essay @replica. I have mixed feelings about some of his writings, but in general, my interactions with him online have been very supportive and kind and it was a blast to read a piece not written by Thomas Cox where I was just nodding my head the whole time.

Two things:
-Firstly, to echo @criminiminal’s sentiment that this thread went on for so long without acknowledging such a crucial structuring element of musical reality, since Twitter keeps giving me notifications about shit that doesn’t involve me, it does actually help me see tweets I wouldn’t otherwise see because I can’t really spend time on that platform…it’s always just felt genuinely unhealthy to me (but hey, I post on it cuz other people aren’t gonna talk about me, I gotta remind people I exist as much as I hate it). Anyhoo, I was quite happy to log on and see Zola Jesus make this following post:

I literally was writing a show review last night that was Ploy, Piezo, Batu, and Forest Drive West along with three local DJ’s and the second I walked into the abandoned Manhattan office building in which the party was being held, it was just like, oh, obbbbbbviously whoever throws this party has money and connections I could never dream of…the tix were $50 (I got listed by one of the DJs, thank dog) and the organizers had the gall to call for volunteer help (though it was the first proper sound system I’ve seen at a NYC party in some time but still, quite a luxury).

To go back to @criminiminal:
“I’ve been hesitant to use terms like “trustfunders” because 1) I don’t want to come off as bitter (which I am) but mostly 2) I’m honestly just happy that there are people out there using their wealth to create art/communities instead of buying Porsches.”

Yes, this is the mature and healthy attitude (though trust bruv, they are also definitely buying nice cars as well that cost more than our homes/year of rent). But really, I’m done tolerating this shit…should someone be shamed for having money and wanting to “contribute” to the culture? No! But when it’s ONE class of people doing it who often shared the same east coast private boarding schools and liberal arts colleges, it’s not good for anyone. And it’s not always trustfunders…I’ve known some savvy label heads who just knew how to secure eccentric investors and I’m a bit more forgiving to that latter strategy as that’s my only hope for ever getting my own shit off the ground as I refuse to work with corporations. But still, it’s important to see where the money is coming from and who it’s ultimately benefitting (probably more ego than artisty). I’m truly not trying to strike a kill the rich stance here, but while I feel this is something I talk about daily with my close music friends, it’s not a discussion that’s as ubiquitous as it should be…though I also have a hard time seeing anything changing as a result of it.

What’s important in my mind is to just always keep an eye towards capital and how our love for art and music can actually lead us to catering to and allowing the bourgeoisie to continue to set the cultural agenda, as they have for the whole of modernity and post-modernity (any exception tends to prove the rule in my book).

OK, apologies for the rant…depression makes me a shittier writer;) Also, is anyone familiar with Mark Fisher’s writings on mental health and capitalism? That’s an idea that always appealed to me just because I personally have felt that connection in many ways.


at this point, the mature outlook is the only position left for me to take. many years ago, I said some snarky shit about this very same thing on an RA comment thread and the mob assassinated me so brutally I don’t know if I’ll ever truly get over it. even the artist himself logged in to humiliate me. asked me if I was interested in becoming his intern…he needed someone to wash his Audi.


Oh m8, I’m sorry to hear that…I experienced just a whiff of that wrath when I chided the Andy Beta article on fourth world music. I actually came to this forum following a deeply depressing experience on an FB record collector group–where I’ve made some great older friends but is largely populated by ‘collectors’ who care more about being right in their minds than just loving music for what it is. I posted Burzum’s Filosofem as I had a wonderful political scientist subletter who studied right wing politics in metal but who also was a fan since his teens…and the long and very relatable story I penned about being able to enjoy a music that I could never hear on its own due to the controversial nature of Varg (and his virulent racism, which I certainly do not support). I got called a nazi and a sincerity troll and while I like to think I have thick skin, I also realized that reasonable discussion was just not a possibility.

Another time, I made a comment about how the group wasn’t nearly as diverse in taste as it liked to fashion itself and was just crucified…but i had some great chats as a result with one UK label head making the following astute observation: “Whenever someone defines themselves by their eclecticism and open-mindedness, they’re bound to react near-violently when that self-perception is challenged in some way.” But people tend to like the status quo if it works for them, huh?

That’s truly vile about the Audi…genuinely just made my stomach turn. But appreciate you sharing that as part of what I’m studying is how comments sections have become the new ‘taste police’…where a reviewer once had the power to cultivate a following who would buy a record on the strength of a review alone, now it seems like ‘reviews’ are just the prelude to comment wars. I hope you nor everyone else ever feel that way in this space. It’s so disheartening how those forums breed their own scenes almost, in a sense.


That Zola Jesus tweet…I mean stuff like Arca and SOPHIE are all over even mainstream media, are these not experimental music artists? I simply don’t follow that there are less experimentation going on nowadays, it is just self-segretating into weird micro-scenes on bandcamp or whatever. Also festivals such as Unsound, Atonal etc are pretty hyped and pretty much off-center.

Idk about the ‘trustfunders’ (not really a term we use here in welfare state scandinavia) running things. There’s no one living off electronic music here anyway, hah.


@zurkonic no worries! you live and you learn! troll with the trolls and you might get trolled…

@chava yeah, I think the implication here is that the success of SOPHIE and Arca was no mistake…i.e. if you don’t run with the rich kids you might not have a shot.


@criminiminal Fair enough, you got a point there. To me it seems succesful ‘experimental’ acts today succeed only if they a have very clear cut conceptual/visual or performative side to it as well. Which makes sense when the money is in festivals/performance or ads/licensing and not record sales or even streaming. Aphex Twin only ‘got big in america’ when he got Chris Cunningham to make all those (overrated!) videos. Even though I am not a fan, I applaud Autechre to play without visuals for this reason as well despite its kinda old school ‘let the music feel for itself’-techno puritanism.


wow. dickheads.

RA comments are a warzone anyways

  1. Be a producer not a consumer.

  2. Limit your social usage to once a day, for a predetermined amount of time.

  3. Use social media managers so you can post content without getting roped into the social networking side of the platforms.

  4. Outsource :man_shrugging:


the hardwax twitter account is lols, they just tweet that weeks releases all as a seperate tweet monsoon :rofl:

re:thread,-27 points for me because I nuh read the whole thing, but the grains of salt a take from the situation (personally) are

a. don’t get worried about the expansion of the universe, it won’t stop nor will it adhere in a linear expected behaviour

b. yes there seams to be much more time invested in social media, however this only makes real life experiences that much more glorious and special. get out of the comfort/complacentcy zone and enjoy them!


First two points are life guidelines imo


someone crawled their website for the most used terms:


omd, am dyyyyyyying rn…thanks for sharing this! giggling super hard.

personally, any release that has the descriptors ‘stepping,’ ‘tripping,’ and ‘leftfied’ i’m guaranteed to scope (and generally avoid ‘big room’ and ‘festival ready’).


I’m completely opposite…bring the anthems!


dat dreamy r&b…